Discussions on Theater
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Looks like we need to add a Compositions property to the Play Type, in addition to the Soundtracks property. Some of those old musicals do not have a Soundtrack... only Compositions by Composers and sung by Cast members.
OR, we create a new Type called "Musical Play" to hold the songs, perhaps cast members who sang them, and other things specific to Musicals ?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Matchgirls and http://www.ovrtur.com/production/2881160 and http://books.google.com/books?id=CPcLk8SWOgIC&lpg=PA217&ots=UQEHIGrrki&dq=This%20Life%20Of%20Mine%20the%20match%20girls&pg=PA217#v=onepage&q=This%20Life%20Of%20Mine%20the%20match%20girls&f=false
(hmmm...what would Tom Cruise in 'Rock of Ages' do ?)
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I want to propose a new property, “preliminary forms,” that might be applied to the following types within the Theater domain: - play - theater - production
This property will serve to connect artistic “products” with their artistic “process.” What little access the general public has to the private processes of artists is mostly contained in websites that remain hidden if not sought out. It is important for the less expansive body of data which surrounds artistic means rather than its so-called ends, not be lost in the web’s expanse. A “preliminary form” property will begin to link process to product and bridge these gaps.
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As an example:
http://www.ibdb.com/venue.php?id=1327
http://www.freebase.com/view/en/gerald_schoenfeld_theatre
Has approximate seating of 1093. I wonder which enclosed theatre in the world has the largest seating ?!? Hmm...
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Funnily enough, I was just working on this issue last week. Take a look at Venue. It's intended to be usable for all kinds of venues, rather than having to add capacity individually to all types of venues that have seating capacity.
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I'm trying to run a simple query of what productions have been done in a certain location (whether that's a state, a city or even a theatre) but I can't seem to figure it out.
Has anyone done this?
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Doing this by theater is pretty straightforward:
[{ "id": null, "name": null, "type": "/theater/theater", "theatrical_productions_staged_here": [{ "id": null }] }]You can do it somewhat by other locations, too, although you probably won't get everything because this query relies on the /theater/theater instances to also be typed as /location/location, which they may not be. Note also that it also requires the theater to be directly linked to the containing location (e.g. if a theater is entered as being contained by London, but not England, querying for productions in London will find it, but not queries for England, let alone the UK).
[{ "id": null, "name": null, "type": "/location/location", "contains": [{ "name":null, "id":null, "/theater/theater/theatrical_productions_staged_here": [{ "id": null }] }] }] -
The point-and-click way to do this is to start at http://www.freebase.com/view/theater/views/theater_production and filter using the criterium "performed at" "is" "" You can even extract the resulting query from that page, although you probably want to first delete any columns that you're not interested in to simplify the query and eliminate unnecessary and confusing cruft.
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can we add dates for when a work was composed (start, end)? i'd like to start building timeline visualizations of this. this is particularly applicable to classical music but could be generally useful. for instance a timeline of brahms's symphonys (it took him ~14 years to write it because he felt so pressured coming after beethoven's 9th).
secondly - place composed (probably non unique) would be interesting for mapping the works composed. for example - dvorak's new world symphony and american string quartet, and mapping liszt's travels. in general there's quite a lot of data on location composed particularly for classical music that we could easily structure.
thirdly - and this is more complicated, at least for classical music, we should capture the catalog ID - which for many composers is an opus, number combination, but for mozart it was K for Ludwig Ritter von Köchel and haydn and bach also had their own thing.
fourthly - we should also capture key for classical compositions.
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and some more ideas:
to whom the composition was dedicated is often interesting.
who (person, or sometimes entity such as the san francisco opera) commisioned the work is also often interesting.
location, date, and performer of the premeir is also often interesting.
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As with most good user suggestions, I will say: Go try it out!
The question of catalog keys is easiest. Go make /user/arielb/koechel, and create an enumerated property for a Mozart composition type. Other notable catalogs (Schickele) can be similarly modeled. Opus numbers could be a machine-readable string, but probably on a Classical composition type; other compositions do not tend to have those.
The key, dedication, commission, première, all seem like good properties for classical compositions as well.
The date and place of composition is an interesting challenge, an example of a frequent modeling challenge in Freebase. Representing this information complicates the model when done properly; one really wants the composer-composition relationship to be a CVT. However, most compositions don’t have this information readily available, making it an unnecessary composition. Would it be acceptable to have the date(s) and place of composition simply depending from the composition itself? That would mean, for example, that one could not correctly describe compositions begun by one composer and completed by another.
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ok - i'll look into the catalog numbers seperately in a classical music domain once i get around to it.
i set up a user domain for dedications (Dedicated Work). I think this could be generally useful (applied to literature and what not) and does not need to be directly tied to composition.
Place of composition should likely be non unique since there are numerous instances where the composer travelled while writing the piece. I think for modeling place composed similar to places lived is sufficient. Similarly, capturing a start and end date is also likely sufficient. Modelling compositions begun by one composer and finished by others is basically just hard (see this example) and happens infrequently enough that i think if someone cared enough they could break out the variant completions into seperate compositions. but for simplicity's sake, i think just having a date begun, date completed pair on the composition itself would help capture lots of useful data.
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Been thinkin about the right way to handle place and dates of composition.
I think the creation of any work of art (including theater, film, visual art, whatever) should be considered a /project/project with the /music/composition being the /project/project_focus. This allows for multiple roles for collaborative works as well as start/end dates for each role and subsection. I would go as far to say that every major work of art should have a property that points to the project of it's creation.
I've been trying to figure out if a creative process deserves to be a child class of /project/project, but I can't think of a compelling reason.
Now, location isn't so much a property of a composition as it is a property of the composer (or author or sculptor) at the time of their participation in the /project/project. So map Liszt's travels in his own /person/person/places_lived cvt and then you can implicitly figure out where he was when he was involved in the /project/project focusing on each piece. This would require a more detailed places_lived field than most artists currently have, but I think that's a good thing.
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For some compositions, the location composed actually had an impact on the work itself such as String Quartet No. 12. This also enables interesting views of compositions such as Locations for Mozart compositions.
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This article is typed as an Opera and a Composition; West Side Story is typed as a Play, Production, and Composition (ignoring Adapted Work, Award-Winning Work and Book). Which is better? That is, how should musicals be typed in general?
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Forgot the link to West Side Story.
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Musicals are plays. Musicals are not generally compositions, though -- I think that typing is wrong. It shouldn't be typed as a production, either -- just like Books are not Book Editions, Plays are not Productions.
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OK, I'll try to remember that.
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I think that the play type should have a 'setting' property which can be used to describe the place where the place is set. The wikipedia play templates also have this field.
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We currently have fictional setting which can be used for this. You can co-type the play as work of fiction and then use this, if you want. Note that the settings don't have to be fictional themselves; a fictional story set in San Francisco has its setting as San Franciso. Also note that the fictional universe stuff is used for films, books, tv, computer games, and so on, so there's no reason not to bring plays into the fold.
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